This gave me a lot to think about (or visualize, or have a conversation with the ‘other’ inside of my head).
I have a lot of ‘movies’ in my mind, and I also have an inner voice, but I’m not sure if that inner voice is me thinking out loud in my head or talking to myself?
I can say that the inner voice and pictures in my mind were much louder when I was going through some real struggles. Life was not making sense so the commotion was louder, but man did it lend itself to creativity! I have gained much wisdom and peace the last two years and my mind seems more quiet. Everything is on low volume, like background music, instead of 7 records playing at once.
You are welcome! Thank you for your comment and for this question because I think this is key:
> I have a lot of ‘movies’ in my mind, and I also have an inner voice, but I’m not sure if that inner voice is me thinking out loud in my head or talking to myself?
I think this is the part that makes the whole thing so confusing! I don't believe I have an internal narrative, and yet I constantly *imagine* myself talking to others as I rehearse or replay real-life conversations. Or, this is how I write -- I imagine saying the next words, trying different combinations and then write down the what sounds best.
The reason I think this is different is that, in my imagination, it is me who is in control. I decide what to visualize or say, or whether do it at all. It also takes conscious effort to imagine. The internal narrative, on the other hand, happens *to* the person (e. g. the experience of Eleanor Longden in "The Voices In My Head" video). This is why I think that the entity that talks to a person through the voice in their head is the same entity that makes us feel emotions (or, indeed, any other feelings). That entity, I believe, is the person's subconscious mind.
I understand what you’re saying (as best as I can wrap my head around this fascinating topic).
I can intentionally imagine things, but I will say that creative ideas and problem solving seem more like (speaking to me?). That part feels more subconscious.
And you saying it’s the same entity that makes us feel emotion makes a lot of sense! I feel things deeply, and when I write, especially poetry, it feels like it pours out of me, like it’s all being whispered in my ear, without intentional thought. I can’t explain where it comes from. Not sure if that would be same? I write bc I feel compelled to, it’s almost like I’m documenting my own evolution, the connecting of dots bc the emotional experience is feeding me wisdom.
I’ll have to watch that video. Thank you for replying!
Thanks for sharing! The more I learn about this topic, the more I appreciate how different individual minds might work under the hood. We try to hide these differences so as to appear as "normal". But maybe we can achieve much more if we learn to appreciate and leverage our individual strengths? I know I almost completely lack at least one trait that appears to be quite useful, while possessing another that I wish was more developed in others.
It's hard to tell because I also see serious issues with the way we are brought up as children. Maybe those two traits could be successfully combined in an individual, just not in the present environment.
It’s interesting you bring up how we were brought up as children, and that people also want to appear normal. I completely agree with you.
I follow the Humanistic Psychologist, Scott Barry Kaufman and he speaks about this, especially standardized tests and the way intelligence is defined. He is advocating for different methods. You might enjoy his work?
I am all for “learn to appreciate and leverage our individual strengths”!
Yes, I have been a subscriber to Scott's newsletter for some time, and listened to a few of his podcasts. Which reminds me that I still need to finish his book, "Transcend..." :)
When it comes to intelligence, I think humans have two distinct mental faculties. One is responsible for learning, the other one is for understanding. Each person is a combination of the two, in different proportions, and developed to different degrees. The tests, of course, lump the two together and it makes their results hard to interpret.
I did watch the TED talk you recommended , and I haven’t experienced what Eleanor Longden has, mine felt more like me talking to myself, depression from trauma, and then feeling like I couldn’t figure out how to ‘learn”, progress.But I did, and I have.
I started doing various calculations in my head, and my creativity never turned off. It felt like a teacher, not my own mind drawing the conclusions. It never felt intentional, it was like synapses firing all at the same time. A subconscious?
For the half I’m not good at; discipline to sit and cohesively write what I want to feels like a harder feat.
Then I guess the next question is what is "me" and what is "myself"? I can describe how is in me -- there is "I", my conscious self, and there is my subconscious mind. And we work together, but we are not the same.
Buddha had this metaphor, comparing a person to an elephant rider. I, my conscious self, is the rider, and my subconscious mind is the elephant. Now, in the end, it is always the elephant that chooses where to go. But am an active participant because I think for myself and I have my elephant's ear. Still, my elephant often get anxious and hard to control.
Then, I have reasons to believe that in many people the rider is not an active participant, or simply asleep in the saddle. So when you talk to them, you really talk to the elephant, and that's what "myself" means to them -- the elephant, not the rider...
This gave me a lot to think about (or visualize, or have a conversation with the ‘other’ inside of my head).
I have a lot of ‘movies’ in my mind, and I also have an inner voice, but I’m not sure if that inner voice is me thinking out loud in my head or talking to myself?
I can say that the inner voice and pictures in my mind were much louder when I was going through some real struggles. Life was not making sense so the commotion was louder, but man did it lend itself to creativity! I have gained much wisdom and peace the last two years and my mind seems more quiet. Everything is on low volume, like background music, instead of 7 records playing at once.
Thank you for your article!
You are welcome! Thank you for your comment and for this question because I think this is key:
> I have a lot of ‘movies’ in my mind, and I also have an inner voice, but I’m not sure if that inner voice is me thinking out loud in my head or talking to myself?
I think this is the part that makes the whole thing so confusing! I don't believe I have an internal narrative, and yet I constantly *imagine* myself talking to others as I rehearse or replay real-life conversations. Or, this is how I write -- I imagine saying the next words, trying different combinations and then write down the what sounds best.
The reason I think this is different is that, in my imagination, it is me who is in control. I decide what to visualize or say, or whether do it at all. It also takes conscious effort to imagine. The internal narrative, on the other hand, happens *to* the person (e. g. the experience of Eleanor Longden in "The Voices In My Head" video). This is why I think that the entity that talks to a person through the voice in their head is the same entity that makes us feel emotions (or, indeed, any other feelings). That entity, I believe, is the person's subconscious mind.
I understand what you’re saying (as best as I can wrap my head around this fascinating topic).
I can intentionally imagine things, but I will say that creative ideas and problem solving seem more like (speaking to me?). That part feels more subconscious.
And you saying it’s the same entity that makes us feel emotion makes a lot of sense! I feel things deeply, and when I write, especially poetry, it feels like it pours out of me, like it’s all being whispered in my ear, without intentional thought. I can’t explain where it comes from. Not sure if that would be same? I write bc I feel compelled to, it’s almost like I’m documenting my own evolution, the connecting of dots bc the emotional experience is feeding me wisdom.
I’ll have to watch that video. Thank you for replying!
Thanks for sharing! The more I learn about this topic, the more I appreciate how different individual minds might work under the hood. We try to hide these differences so as to appear as "normal". But maybe we can achieve much more if we learn to appreciate and leverage our individual strengths? I know I almost completely lack at least one trait that appears to be quite useful, while possessing another that I wish was more developed in others.
It's hard to tell because I also see serious issues with the way we are brought up as children. Maybe those two traits could be successfully combined in an individual, just not in the present environment.
It’s interesting you bring up how we were brought up as children, and that people also want to appear normal. I completely agree with you.
I follow the Humanistic Psychologist, Scott Barry Kaufman and he speaks about this, especially standardized tests and the way intelligence is defined. He is advocating for different methods. You might enjoy his work?
I am all for “learn to appreciate and leverage our individual strengths”!
Yes, I have been a subscriber to Scott's newsletter for some time, and listened to a few of his podcasts. Which reminds me that I still need to finish his book, "Transcend..." :)
When it comes to intelligence, I think humans have two distinct mental faculties. One is responsible for learning, the other one is for understanding. Each person is a combination of the two, in different proportions, and developed to different degrees. The tests, of course, lump the two together and it makes their results hard to interpret.
I did watch the TED talk you recommended , and I haven’t experienced what Eleanor Longden has, mine felt more like me talking to myself, depression from trauma, and then feeling like I couldn’t figure out how to ‘learn”, progress.But I did, and I have.
I started doing various calculations in my head, and my creativity never turned off. It felt like a teacher, not my own mind drawing the conclusions. It never felt intentional, it was like synapses firing all at the same time. A subconscious?
For the half I’m not good at; discipline to sit and cohesively write what I want to feels like a harder feat.
> mine felt more like me talking to myself
Then I guess the next question is what is "me" and what is "myself"? I can describe how is in me -- there is "I", my conscious self, and there is my subconscious mind. And we work together, but we are not the same.
Buddha had this metaphor, comparing a person to an elephant rider. I, my conscious self, is the rider, and my subconscious mind is the elephant. Now, in the end, it is always the elephant that chooses where to go. But am an active participant because I think for myself and I have my elephant's ear. Still, my elephant often get anxious and hard to control.
Then, I have reasons to believe that in many people the rider is not an active participant, or simply asleep in the saddle. So when you talk to them, you really talk to the elephant, and that's what "myself" means to them -- the elephant, not the rider...
Precious, Sir!
Why, thank you!
Of course, you’re very welcome.